Off the Record Podcast – Eps 2
We are being Politically Correct - and drinking a wine of the same name in Eps 4 of Off the Record Podcast. It is "Fear Factor" for Michelle as she tries two elk burgers Scott just prepared - one burger is not as done as she likes. Plus, we test the "red wine with meat" theory...
Jump below if you'd like to read a transcript of the podcast.
What we are drinking:
Michael David's Politically Correct: hhttps://shop.michaeldavidwinery.com/product/MDW-POLITICALLY-CORRECT-RED-BLEND-16-6/750ML
Michael's David's Cute Freakshow Cab Can: https://shop.michaeldavidwinery.com/product/17-FS-Can-4-Pack
Chef Paul's Blackened Seasoning: https://magicseasoningblends.com/shop/blackened-redfish-magic-red101/
Chef Scott's Blackened Salmon on his show "The Sporting Chef" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKm9NMiiGuE
The Story of White Zin (which Sutter Home 'discovered'): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Zinfandel
Hearst Castle: http://hearstcastle.org
Off the Record Podcast - Eps 2 - Transcript
Michelle Scheuermann: You know, should we tell people exactly why we're doing a podcast or just let them...
Scott Leysath: Sure.
[Drinking wine]
Michelle: This is good. This is really good.
Scott: It is good. But it's the Freak Show.
[music]
Intro: Good day and welcome to Off the Record. You'll find us at the intersection of interesting ideas and great pairings. It all tastes good when these two cook it up, so let's listen in to The Sporting Chef, Scott Leysath, and outdoor industry insider, Michelle Scheuermann, as they talk wild game, wine, and anything else that comes to mind. Time to sample and sip our way through the best part of the day, as we go off the record with The Sporting Chef and Michelle.
Michelle: Welcome back. You must have enjoyed the first one, so you're back for round two.
[laughter]
Scott: Big mistake.
Michelle: With Scott and Michelle, Off the Record, meaning anything goes here, but today, Scott, we really have something special for our listeners, don't we?
Scott: Today is my Michelle meat challenge.
[chuckle]
Scott: So Michelle, who grew up in the Midwest, eating...
Michelle: Nothing wrong with that.
Scott: Boiled steaks and potatoes.
Michelle: It was all organic.
Scott: That are covered with who knows what, and I've tried to introduce her to lesser cooked meat. My whole thing, my mantra has always been, "Don't overcook it," and yet Michelle, who does all of my social media and things and... Michelle and I have known each other since 2004. She likes to cook the snot out of it, according to my...
Michelle: Standards.
Scott: Standards, yes.
[laughter]
Scott: So I've got an elk burger. Some with blue cheese. Some without blue cheese. One is cooked medium rare. The other one's cooked medium well. And this is kinda like Fear Factor for Michelle because she's gonna have to eat a piece of medium rare elk burger.
Michelle: Yeah, it's a little past my comfort zone. Just looking at it.
Scott: I know. I know. But that's what the wine is for.
[laughter]
Scott: We've got Michael David, Politically Correct, which is a blend of...
Michelle: Do we have to be politically correct on the... [laughter]
Scott: Preferably not on the show, but the wine is called Politically Correct.
Michelle: Yes.
Scott: And it's a high-dollar wine that you're not gonna be able to find everywhere. Michael David has some very affordable wines, but they also have some high-end wines a lot of you haven't heard of. There are Sloth, Gluttony...
Michelle: Lust.
Scott: Lust, Rapture, and then to balance that, I have a can of Freak Show Cabernet. Yes, a can of Freak Show Cabernet. And we'll...
Michelle: It's the tiniest, cutest little can, too. [laughter]
Scott: It is. It's about a three gulp deal, I think, depending on how much of a goon you are.
Michelle: Right.
Scott: Let's see. The Freak Show... And it comes in either a four-pack or a six-pack.
Michelle: Why don't you bring that over the microphone and just open that puppy up and just get a nice little...
Scott: So here's wine. Right!
[laughter]
Scott: I know. Sounds like a beer, and then we will pour.
Michelle: Go ahead, yeah.
Scott: There's the...
Michelle: That's nice.
Scott: There's the Freak Show. Hey, you know it's like two little samples.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: How many ounces is this?
Michelle: It's gotta be like four ounces.
Scott: I can't read it. If you hear the dogs outside, that's Mac and Floyd going after each other, in a friendly way.
Michelle: They're brothers. It's cool.
Scott: Alright, did you already try that?
Michelle: I was smelling it.
Scott: Okay. What'd it smell like?
[chuckle]
Michelle: Well, I got the elk burger in front of me too. [laughter]
Scott: I know. Look at that rare color on that meat.
Michelle: Back in the last episode, I was telling you about my Buena Vista experience when I did that winemaker blend.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: And one thing that the winemaker taught us, that was very interesting, I thought, was, yes, you swirl your wine to allow it to breathe, and get oxygenated, and all that jazz, but when you stick your nose in, open your mouth. Actually allow it to go in through your mouth.
Scott: That makes sense.
Michelle: Versus your nose.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: So I felt... And like you just taste different things when you do that.
Scott: Okay.
Michelle: So try it. Stick your nose in and then open your mouth, and suck it in.
Scott: Whoa!
Michelle: It's almost like you taste the wine without actually tasting it.
Scott: I can see that. Yeah.
Michelle: Yeah, it's kind of cool. Anyway, I'm a big fan of Buena Vista Winery, in case anyone wants to know.
Scott: Who told you about Buena Vista Winery?
Michelle: You did. You did.
Scott: Right, okay. Thank you.
Michelle: You did. It's owned by a very eccentric Frenchman who actually has a lot of wineries over in Burgundy, and he's very well to do, but...
Scott: Well, yeah.
Michelle: I mean, why not? [laughter]
Scott: And if you're gonna have a winery in Sonoma, you're probably gonna be fairly well to do anyway, I think, but they are...
Michelle: Well, it's the oldest winery in Sonoma.
Scott: It is. And it's really cool, if you go to Sonoma, it's worth checking out Grgich. It's kind of tucked back in there, not too far from there. Buena Vista, they're old school, cool places to hang out, and they're very unlike the large commercial wineries that you see in Sonoma Napa.
Michelle: Right. Okay, so back to the Politically Correct. So I'll read the tasting notes from Michael David. I think if you join their reserve wine club, you might be able to get this, but don't quote me on that. Definitely just go to michaeldavidwinery.com and check it out for yourself, and join their wine club, but they really do have amazing wines, but the tasting notes. One sip of this wine and a glance at the label, it's a very interesting label, you'll see why our 2016 Politically Correct, makes a statement without saying a word. Winemaker Jeff Farthing took a special interest when cherry-picking only the highest quality lots for this Bordeaux-style blend. These individual lots were aged nearly 30 months in French Oak barrels prior to blending, which created a supple balanced red wine. We have 14 1/2% alcohol, 30% new French Oak, and 70% neutral oak. And so there you go, and you took a sip while I was saying that.
Scott: I did take a... I did take a sip.
Michelle: And?
Scott: It's good. It's... I'm gonna...
Michelle: The brothers are just really...
[laughter]
Michelle: We're just gonna have to...
Scott: The dogs are going at it.
Michelle: Yeah. Yeah, I'm not sure. Does one brother usually win?
Scott: No, they take turns. Mac and Floyd, my two setters, they're litter mates, they've spent their whole lives together, and they like to mess around.
Michelle: Wow, this is, this is...
Scott: It's good, right?
Michelle: This is good.
Scott: I know.
Michelle: Wow.
Scott: I wish it had a $15 price tag on it and then I could really make a point. Alright, that's yours...
Michelle: That's my rare?
Scott: But you gotta eat the rare part, don't eat the outside.
Michelle: Okay, okay.
Scott: That's with blue cheese, without blue cheese, and we'll see how that pairs with...
Michelle: Okay, I'm gonna do it without blue cheese. This is very rare. I'm not comfortable right now, but...
Scott: Nothing bad's gonna happen.
Michelle: I've had two glasses of wine.
Scott: Okay, and since this is elk, it has a lot less fat in it, so it's not as juicy.
Michelle: Right. Right.
Scott: But there's nothing to be afraid of. Are you afraid?
Michelle: No, that was okay.
Scott: Now see if the wine tastes any different.
Michelle: Yeah. I forget which one, yeah.
Scott: I'm drinking the Freak Show.
Michelle: The wine helps the burger.
Scott: Right?
Michelle: The wine helps the burger.
Scott: I'm gonna try one with the blue cheese.
Michelle: There's something to be said about drinking wine with meat, a red wine with meat.
Scott: Right? And these burgers sat for a couple of minutes, so they're not... You saw when they came out, the one that I cooked for me...
Michelle: Was juicy.
Scott: Had a lot more juice. And for people that go, "I don't like that blood," it's not blood, it's just juice.
Michelle: It's hard to accept that.
Scott: It looks like blood, I know, but it's not blood. And you'll notice if you let it just rest for a few minutes, it allows the juice in there to redistribute within the piece of meat.
Michelle: Are you a fan of taking a steak before it's done off the grill and letting it rest and maybe putting tinfoil over it or a plate over it?
Scott: You have to tent it a little bit just to keep the heat in.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: But yes, if you wanna let it rest, it's gonna let the juices redistribute within the piece of meat. The worst thing you can do to somebody who says that they don't like the juice in meat or the blood or whatever they wanna call it, is to take the steak off the grill, slap it on the plate, because then they cut into it, and all that juice goes everywhere. If you let it rest for just a few minutes, it'll make a big difference. On a two-pound tri tip, I let it rest for about 10 minutes.
Michelle: Oh, really?
Scott: Yeah. Because as you can tell, as juicy as this was on the cutting board, it's really dried out a lot now because it's elk.
Michelle: Yeah, I like it with the blue cheese better now because you need that little extra something something. And you did use a Hi Mountain seasoning I saw.
Scott: I used the Hi Mountain Venison Rub.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: Alright, now I want you to try one of the outer edges of yours 'cause here's what's gonna happen since this is an elk burger. The more it's cooked, the gamier it's gonna be. When people are cooking ducks and deer and all this and they're trying to get... Cook the gamey flavor out of their game, what they're often doing is making it taste more gamey.
Michelle: Why is that?
Scott: Because there's no fat in there, so it's not very forgiving. So if you add a whole bunch of fat to your burger, it'll be more forgiving and you can cook it a little bit more, 'cause fat adds flavor.
Michelle: Definitely dryer.
Scott: When you order a...
Michelle: Harder to chew.
Scott: Harder to chew, right? And that's the same burger, it's just cooked longer.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: So for me, the victory with a burger is when it's like the Carl's Jr. commercial where it runs down your arm, it's a big sloppy mess. And I like to put an over-easy fried egg on top of mine too, just to make it even messier.
Michelle: Oh, sure.
Scott: But I can tell by... That piece that you're about to eat there looks cooked all the way through, pretty much.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: What are you thinking?
Michelle: I like it with the blue cheese.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: But it's just a tougher piece of meat.
Scott: It's a tougher piece of meat when you cook it that long. And that's gonna... The same rule applies to...
Michelle: It's harder to cut, even. I'm just trying to cut it with my fork and it's just a burger, for crying out loud.
Scott: I want you to do this, and we'll get to this, I want you to try a medium rare steak next time you go out.
Michelle: Alright.
Scott: And do you ever get a blackened steak?
Michelle: Uh-huh.
Scott: Because blackened isn't blackened anymore.
Michelle: What is it supposed to be?
Scott: Okay, this is the way... Paul Prudhomme, who started the whole blackened redfish thing in New Orleans years ago... The restaurants that did it properly had a gigantic white-hot cast iron flat top, but the smaller ones would have a cast-iron skillet. You leave it on full all day long, it's white-hot, and you're putting seasoning on the outside, the blackened seasoning, the white pepper, black pepper, cayenne pepper, garlic powder, whatever, and you're burning that seasoning onto the outside, so the problem is...
Michelle: So you're searing it while keeping it...
Scott: But it's burnt.
Michelle: Okay.
Scott: You're burning that seasoning. What blackening has become now is, "Would you like it blackened or grilled?" and that just means they're gonna put some blackened seasoning on there. So there's nothing blackened about it, and we've really lost that whole blackened thing, and I'd like to get that back. I know I did, on The Sporting Chef show, I did a blackened salmon, and I blackened the snot out of it. It was almost a little too much, trying to make a point.
Michelle: Did you do that on a Camp Chef?
Scott: I did it on a Camp Chef flat top.
Michelle: Really? You got it hot enough?
Scott: And I'm telling you, it's black. You can go to YouTube and see that there on The Sporting Chef YouTube channel...
Michelle: We'll put it in the show notes.
Scott: We will put it in the show notes. Good thinking.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: Now I'm gonna try some of this overcooked crap here.
Michelle: Yeah. You cooked it.
Scott: I know.
[laughter]
Scott: But I overcooked it and it is dry.
Michelle: I definitely like the blue cheese on the... I'm not a huge blue cheese fan, but for some reason, blue cheese and wild game go so well together.
Scott: Well, and I was wondering how the blue cheese would affect how it tastes. And again, you've got the much more discriminating palate when it comes to wine.
[laughter]
Scott: Does it affect the taste of the wine to you? 'Cause doesn't food... Isn't it... Shouldn't it matter?
Michelle: They say if you're eating something really acidic, then you should have a less acidic wine or vice versa. I've never really... I'll be honest with you since I'm into my third glass of wine, I've never really got the whole food pairing, acidic/not acidic thing down.
Scott: Try that with your Chardonnay.
Michelle: Okay. Yeah, alright. I still have some Chardonnay left.
Scott: Michelle is drinking the Chardonnay, making a face.
[laughter]
Scott: So you didn't make that face when you drank the Chardonnay without food.
Michelle: Before. Right.
Scott: So what just happened? You were just eating a piece of meat with the blue cheese, then you drank it, some Chardonnay. So what... You didn't... Your face changed.
Michelle: Yeah, I didn't like it. For some reason, the red wine...It's just mellow.
Scott: And what does the white wine do? Competes with it?
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: Okay. So...
Michelle: It has to be the acidity level.
Scott: I don't know. So the old red wine with meat and white wine with fish kind of applies?
Michelle: Right.
Scott: And again, as we've said here before, if you don't like red wine...
Michelle: Drink whatever you want.
Scott: Drink whatever you want.
Michelle: But...
Scott: Hopefully, eventually... Where most people start is with a lighter... In the old days, it was always the... White Zinfandel was the entree.
Michelle: Yeah. Did you know that was a mistake?
Scott: I did not know.
Michelle: Yeah. The gentleman who... I think Beringer, I probably have to Google it, but he mistakenly left the skins on too long to give it that Rosé color.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: And then he decided because he made so much of it, that he was gonna just sell it, so he called it a White Zinfandel and it turned out to be what we call the housewife... What was it?
Scott: I don't know. But that was Beringer? 'Cause...
Michelle: I think it was Beringer that made it.
Scott: 'Cause I always thought it was Sutter Home. 'Cause Sutter Home, they're the one...
Michelle: Someone started and made a mistake. I need to Google this.
Scott: Sutter Home took that ball and ran with it, I know, with their White Zin, and they're kind of in the same neighborhood, they're in St. Helena. And back when I had a relationship with Beringer when I was in the restaurant business, they called their White Zinfandel Chateau Cash Flow, because...
Michelle: Yeah, that's it.
Scott: Right?
Michelle: Right.
Scott: 'Cause they sold so much of that White Zinfandel. So where a lot of people start...
Michelle: I'll put the White Zinfandel link in the show notes because...
Scott: There you go.
Michelle: It's from Wikipedia, it's really interesting.
Scott: And the White Zinfandel, people normally move on from White Zinfandel. It was funny, I had a... White Zinfandel isn't exactly aged or has a...
Michelle: Well, let me read this. I'll read this, it's really interesting. So it's dry to sweet, which we all know, that's why we like it, and it's pink-colored wine, which that's again why we enjoy it so much, 'cause we... It's pink and ladies just love the pink stuff. It was invented by Sutter Home Family Vineyards, so you're right, so I scratch my Beringer reference and insert Sutter Home. Winemaker Bob in 1975, originally the result of stuck fermentation and a fortuitous accident. So he didn't mean to do this.
Scott: This was Bob?
Michelle: Bob. Bob did this.
Scott: So like Stingcher Bob?
Michelle: Here's the last name, I don't know how to pronounce it.
Scott: Whatever.
Michelle: Okay, so White Zinfandel is made from the Zinfandel white grape, which would otherwise produce a bold and spicy red wine. As of 2018, Sutter Home is the number one White Zinfandel with 29.1% dollar share of the $300 million White Zinfandel market, and 73.1% of the 187 mL White Zinfandel market.
Scott: They really got it.
Michelle: It's very popular, it's why...
Scott: They took the White Zinfandel ball and ran with it obviously.
Michelle: And it was an accident.
Scott: And when was the last time you drank White Zinfandel?
Michelle: I will be... A long time. Yeah. I would...
Scott: What about Rosé?
Michelle: Oh, I love me some Rosé all day. Rosé.
Scott: Summertime.
Michelle: Yeah, Rosé all the time. Yeah. J Vineyards had some good... Has some good Rosé.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: Are they Sonoma side?
Scott: I don't know.
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: I think they would be. Yeah, I don't think they're Napa side.
Michelle: They were good... That was a good vineyard that Wayne and I visited the last time we were doing a wine tour around here, and I highly recommend J Vineyards.
Scott: So of the lesser cooked elk burger that you're going for now as opposed to the more cooked elk burger...
Michelle: 'Cause it's not as tough. And I like the blue cheese.
Scott: How will that... Well, there's blue cheese on this overcooked one too. So is this gonna change the way you order a burger? And are you worried about the E.coli thing? 'Cause there has been so much hysteria about E.coli we haven't... 'Cause it's from ground meat and somebody...
Michelle: And just improper handling. I mean let's be honest.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: Right.
Scott: But of the burgers that are sold in the United States, how many... What percentage of people do you think get E.coli?
Michelle: I can't... Yeah.
Scott: I'll bet it's really, really, really, really, really...
Michelle: I think probably more people probably get E.coli from raw eggs.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: I could Google this too.
Scott: No.
[laughter]
Scott: And when you're processing your own game, it's really important. When you're breaking down a deer to make sure that you're... There's no... If you happen to shoot it and there was... And it went through the digestive tract, you have to be really, really, really careful and you wanna cook that all the way through, and you wanna make sure you don't cross-contaminate because that's... Bad things will happen. But if you're cooking whole muscle meat like a steak and that kinda thing, just make sure that it's seared all the way on the outside. And as I have said forever and ever and ever, searing meat on the outside does not seal in the juices like it says in the commercials on TV, it just makes it taste better.
Michelle: We should do like a MythBusters...
Scott: I'm telling you, the searing meat, the way it was determined is, you cook it slow, you cook it fast with sear on the outside. You bring it to the same internal temperature and the moisture content in the center is exactly the same. It sounds really cool to say, "When you sear meat, it seals in the juices." But if you think about it, you could take your pinkie and push down on that steak and all these juices are gonna come out...
Michelle: No matter what.
Scott: It doesn't create some kind of protective mylar coating on the outside.
Michelle: Let's talk about these two wines again.
Scott: Alright.
Michelle: So I've been really drinking the 2016, Politically Correct. Versus the canned Freak Show. Could it be that...
Scott: Yes, it could be.
[laughter]
Michelle: That the 2016 is $50 and the can was...
Scott: In your case, yes.
Michelle: Like a couple dollars, I don't even know what the can is.
Scott: So what I should've done...
Michelle: You should've done a blind tasting.
Scott: I've done a blind tasting which we'll get to because Michelle won't drink Merlot, and she watched Sideways and it's changed her life, and...
Michelle: And that movie is like 20 years old, and it's still affecting...
Scott: And have you been down to that area? Down to...
Michelle: I have not been down... 'cause it's Santa Barbara, and we always fly into Sacramento to see you and then do Napa Valley and stuff. And so, Santa... It's like a whole another world down there, I mean, you're gonna fly into LA and then head south and I don't know, but I do wanna visit the Hearst mansion someday. And that's down... What?
Scott: I've driven by it. I'm not going in. Are you kidding me?
Michelle: What? It's like a million square feet.
Scott: Yeah, I don't go any places like that, I'm a horrible tourist.
Michelle: You don't do cultural things?
Scott: Let's just say... Alright, so many years ago, Janel and I... My wife and I were in South Carolina, and we went to one of the plantations to go for a tour. I drove through the parking lot in the little circle in front. I don't know if we picked up a brochure or not, and then I said, "Well, that's enough of that. Let's just go."
Michelle: Oh my God! [laughter] Poor Janel.
Scott: I know, ladies, he's available, and so my wife still hasn't let me live that down, but I'm a horrible tourist, I grew up inside the Beltway outside of DC, and every weekend was... Or every week was a different field trip and go to the Smithsonian and all that blabitty blah, and I'd rather do something than watch what somebody else did.
Michelle: The Hearst, I mean...
Scott: I know. I would rather go fishing than to go to the Hearst Castle and see what's in there.
Michelle: Okay. Well, it looks really cool and I would want to visit so maybe somebody we'll do that...
Scott: And if you ever plan on going to the Northern California Coast or Central California Coast, and you look at the map and you go, "Boy, Highway 1. We could go from Monterey down to the Hearst Castle and look at that, we could see the coast," it's a really, really, really slow drive.
Michelle: Oh, really?
Scott: It's some of the most incredibly scenic, but to get from, say, San Luis Obispo to Monterey, it's gonna take you a few hours. If you look at it on the map and you're going, "Oh, it's not that far at all." But really, it's longer than you think.
Michelle: Why is that?
Scott: Because it's a really super tight, winding road. If there's...
Michelle: Is it four lanes, two and two?
Scott: No.
Michelle: Oh, it's two lanes?
Scott: It's two lanes.
Michelle: Oh...
Scott: So there's a couple of turnouts here and there, but if there's an RV in front of you, you're screwed. If there's a rock slide, you're screwed. Bridges washed out, forget it, you're never going home, but it's worth it one time. I made the mistake of doing it more than once and we were in a hurry, and I thought, "Hey, we were right by Hearst Castle." We were Morro Bay, and I thought, "Well, we'll just hit up the road and head over to Monterey," and it was a bad idea. So don't do that.
Michelle: Okay, duly noted. But some time I would like to get down there and I'd like to do a Sideways tour, I'm not gonna lie.
Scott: Well, and where I think you're really oughta go is to go to Oregon.
Michelle: Really?
Scott: Go to the Willamette Valley, it's incredible. It's so gorgeous, it's not nearly as crowded as Napa or Sonoma. They have weather there, so you'll be there in this beautiful mountainous area and you got clouds and sun, and it might even rain a little bit, and the Pinots are incredible, I don't know if you're a Pinot person or not, but they have their place as well. Now, Oregon wines should not be overlooked.
Michelle: Well, I think they said that that particular area is the same as Burgundy.
Scott: I don't know, never been to Burgundy...
Michelle: I am going to Google that too. So I think that's why it does so well, I don't know.
Scott: I don't know either.
Michelle: So we've almost polished off this elk burger, except you're not eating the well done burger.
Scott: No, I don't wanna eat the well done. And the more cooked burger to me has more of an off taste to it than the lesser cooked burger, but that's... Fortunately we have some wine to wash it down with.
Michelle: Yeah, I didn't notice the taste as much in that regard.
Scott: More texture...
Michelle: Yeah.
Scott: Moisture...
Michelle: It was more of a texture thing for me.
Scott: So I know, next time you're gonna say, "I'll have my medium rare."
Michelle: That's right.
Scott: Right. Sure you will.
Michelle: Especially when it comes to wild game. [laughter] Alright, Scott. Well, let's wrap this up.
Scott: Alright, so the Freak Show, the can of Freak Show Cab.
Michelle: I haven't even drank that much...
Scott: They do have Freak Show in a bottle, Michael David has Freak Show Cabernet in a bottle.
Michelle: So why would you get it in a can, just for portability?
Scott: Pretty handy, yeah. If you're going to the park, going to a concert. Sometimes it's a little easier to throw a little can in there. So... [chuckle] It's hard for you to go back to Freak Show...
Michelle: After having the...
Scott: Yeah. After having...
Michelle: The Politically Correct.
Scott: The Politically Correct.
Michelle: It's so smooth.
Scott: The Politically Correct is outstanding. It is really smooth. It's not big and jammy, it's just very refined to me.
Michelle: Again, this is a wine that I would give to anybody.
Scott: Right.
Michelle: Especially someone who's new to drinking wine or says they don't like a particular wine, I would forward them this.
Scott: And if you can't get it where you are, you gotta go to Michael David Highway 12 in Lodi...
Michelle: Maybe join the club. I mean, they're really good to work with...
Scott: They are.
Michelle: I mean, they don't sponsor this podcast.
Scott: Nope.
Michelle: But we just like their wine.
Scott: I like them, and I like...
Michelle: And it really strengthens my argument that good wines are around $50.
Scott: Don't take that as an endorsement of $50 wines. Yes, it's a really good $50 wine, but I'll tell you, if you didn't have that Politically Correct, and I had just served you that Freak Show Cab, you'd be fine with it.
Michelle: Yeah, I would drink it. Sure, sure, sure.
Scott: And it's $15 or $16, whatever it is there. So give Michael David a try, and my bottom line here is, "Stop cooking the snot out of your wild game, it'll taste better if you don't.”
Michelle: Yeah. Alright, thank you, Scott, until next time.
Scott: You got it.
Outro: Well, time sure flies when you're loading up on good food, good wine and great conversation. Find more Scott Leysath at sportingchef.com where you can also nab a free wild game e-book and sign up for his two times a month newsletter, track him on social media and see how to watch the Sporting Chef airing on Sportsman Channel and Dead Meat on Sportsman Channel and My Outdoor TV. For more Michelle, check out bulletproofcomm.com, that's two M's on the first "com", one on the second, bulletproofcomm.com. She runs her own marketing communications firm, handling PR, social media and more for some of the biggest names in the outdoors. That's it for now. We'll see you next time when, again, we go Off the Record, with the Sporting Chef and Michelle.